The Daily Grind: Folgers' Formula for Flavor & Familiarity

How do you make a great cup of coffee every single time? Jim Trout, Vice President, Research & Development--Coffee at the J. M. Smucker Co., reveals how Folgers Coffee uses data, design, and taste tests to perfect its signature flavor. ☕🔬

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Tomorrow's World Today - S9E4 – Perfect Pour

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:00

Welcome to the Tomorrow's World Today podcast. We sit down with experts, world changing innovators, creators and makers to explore how they're taking action to make tomorrow's world a better place for technology, science, innovation, sustainability, the arts and more. On this episode, host George Davison, who is also the host of the TV series Tomorrow's World Today, sits down with Jim Trout, Vice President for Coffee Research and Development at Folgers. Jim discusses the company's 175-year history, its commitment to consistent, smooth coffee through rigorous research and proprietary blending, and its focus on sustainability and emerging trends like instant iced coffee.

SPEAKER_02: 0:43

Hello, everybody, and welcome to another edition of Tomorrow's World Today. And our guest today is Jim Trout. He is the vice president for coffee research and development at Folgers. Welcome.

SPEAKER_01: 0:55

Thanks, George.

SPEAKER_02: 0:56

It's great to be on the show. Well, I was looking forward to meeting you. You've been in research and development for quite a long time. That's right. R&D is what people tend to call it as a shortened version. Can you tell us a little bit about The Folgers coffee, in a broad way, can you talk a little bit about it?

SPEAKER_01: 1:14

Absolutely. Well, Folgers is America's leading at-home coffee. And we really focus on delivering a nice, consistent, smooth profile that's repeatable day after day throughout the year. And we also try to keep up with new trends, make sure that we are providing new flavors and formats and really staying current for our consumers. So

SPEAKER_02: 1:37

that would require some... some research, going out and doing studies, let's say, in the field. How would you go about doing observational analysis on taste? That might be an interesting dialogue.

SPEAKER_01: 1:51

Yeah, so we do a lot of in-home consumer research where we will go into consumers' homes with one or two people and we'll watch their habits. And very importantly, we'll look for pain points. You know, what are compensating behaviors? What are things that they're doing that They kind of get by with their routine, but maybe we could make it easier. And then we'll also run a lot of blind taste tests where we'll put different products in front of consumers and understand what parts of the taste profile do they like and what parts are just kind of okay. And then we put all that together to design and optimize our products. Well, that's interesting.

SPEAKER_02: 2:28

So in other words, you can figure out a way to take a coffee bean, roast it, grind it, and try to get a smooth tasting product universally. So wherever you go in the world, you could have your favorite coffee with you, right? That's right, you could. So can you walk us down the path

SPEAKER_01: 2:47

of how can you create such a consistent product? Yeah, that's a really good question. And it's something that we've been working on for decades. You could argue all the way back to our founding in 1850 out in San Francisco during the gold rush era. And really, there's a couple different parts of it that drive the consistency. One is when we go to purchase the coffee, which comes from around the world, various origins. Each of those origins has some nuances to it. And then you also have this phenomena where coffee grows in the tropics. And so, you know, countries that are north of the equator harvest at one time of the year. Countries south of the equator harvest kind of the opposite time of the year. And so as that crop ages throughout the year, you know, the quality can change. And so we have to learn how to buy from countries north or south, depending on the time of the year, and put those together in a way that that taste profile is consistent throughout. So we've, you know, over the years have gone out, cataloged these coffees, assign scores to them, and then we use proprietary modeling to know what to combine with what to create that taste. So you have your own secret recipe, don't

SPEAKER_02: 4:02

you? We do. That's fabulous. That is such a big part of business, having something unique that's hard to repeat. and probably it's not patentable. It's just trade secret information, right? We have

SPEAKER_01: 4:17

several trade secrets. That's exactly right.

SPEAKER_02: 4:18

That's wonderful. Well, congratulations. Thank you. Now, this business has

SPEAKER_01: 4:23

been around for quite a long time. That's right. Yep. How long? Well, we were founded back in May of 1850. So we're right at the 175th anniversary of the company. And back then, the name of the company was the Pioneer Steam Coffee and Spice Mills. That was out in San Francisco. And the premise was to find a way to provide coffee to the gold miners in a way that was more convenient. So prior to this innovation that we had, which is really roasting ground coffee packed in a tin, that was the innovation. You know, coffee was just brought in from other countries off of ships, and it was unroasted, it was raw, and miners would take that into the hills, and they would have to roast that in a pan over a fire, crack it or grind it somehow, and then boil that. That's a lot of work. It is. What you really want to be doing is out there finding gold, not messing with roasting coffee. So that was really the innovation that sprang the company to life.

SPEAKER_02: 5:22

Boy, to be able to go back in time and see some of those innovations coming around, right? Absolutely. So, you know, what's your story, Jim? Can you talk a little bit about yourself professionally and personally?

SPEAKER_01: 5:34

Yeah, yeah. So I grew up in eastern Ohio and, you know, some role models in my life really kind of opened my eyes to science and math, especially my sister, who's older than me. And she ended up going into veterinary medicine. And I really saw all the different courses that she took. And I really got excited about math and science. And so I kind of followed that through school. And I wound up going to college. I'm a chemical engineer by degree. And I started my career at Procter& Gamble. I was there about 17 years before the business that I was in moved into, which was coffee. It was purchased by the J.M. Smucker Company. Today, I'm married. I've got three children. And they're all graduated from college. now, so we're empty nesters. Well, it sounds like a good journey in your life. You enjoy your work. I love my work. Many times, I'll be driving into the office, and I almost have to pinch myself. I'm like, I get to go in and create new coffee products and smell that wonderful aroma, and that's my career. It's a lot of

SPEAKER_02: 6:39

fun. Research and development is what we do as well, a lot of it, and One of the things I like about it is it's something different all the time. Exactly. Never gets boring, does it? That's right.

SPEAKER_01: 6:49

Yep.

SPEAKER_02: 6:50

Could you talk a little bit about, you know, why it attracted you, R&D?

SPEAKER_01: 6:54

Yeah. So, you know, there's, I think when you look at careers in this general area, you know, think about the technical area, you can maybe be attracted to things that are very repeatable and reproducible, like, you know, manufacturing, for example. And that could be very rewarding because you see those results right away. And that's fantastic. And R&D, frankly, there's a pretty high failure rate. Most of what we do in R&D doesn't end up working, right? But once in a while, once in a while, you find something that is like lightning in a bottle. And to see that come to life and make it to the store shelf and be able to go visit that in the stores with your family and know that that didn't exist before is just an amazing feeling. I love that

SPEAKER_02: 7:43

lightning in a bottle analogy because it's so true. You just don't know when it's going to hit. You just have to keep going, don't you?

SPEAKER_01: 7:52

You have to keep going. Persistence and perseverance are two things that I often talk to people about. that are really important in this field. You got to keep at it.

SPEAKER_02: 8:03

So you must have that trait in you. Can you track it back as to where do you think you started to become a person like that?

SPEAKER_01: 8:10

Yeah, that's a really good question. You know, I really look back to my parents, who both were just incredibly hard workers. And whenever they faced obstacles, you know, they never gave up. And I referenced my sister earlier, you know, she was the same way. And I think I just learned that kind of at an early age. And whenever I would encounter struggles, you know, my family would always encourage me, well, keep going on this, don't quit, right? Even when I played sports, things like that, if things weren't going well, I'd always finish that out. You know, I would never stop in the

SPEAKER_02: 8:45

middle. That's a great way to live your life.

SPEAKER_01: 8:48

Thanks.

SPEAKER_02: 8:49

So let's, you know, now that we've talked a little bit about R&D and let's call it the lab, so to speak. There's R&D as well in how you come up with a name or how you come up with your brand, your colors and everything else. Right, right. You know, in the side of packaging and storytelling, can you talk to us a little bit about the brand? I mean, it's a well-known brand. How did that... come about. Do you know the history on some of that?

SPEAKER_01: 9:19

We know some of the history, for sure. There was a book published called The Folger Way, which chronicles the history of the Folger Coffee Company, all the way back to when it was founded, and even really, frankly, before that in the life of James Folger. And the name Folger's which is just F-O-L-G-E-R-S, used to be, its name was actually Folger, and then the brand name was Folgers apostrophe S. Later on, that apostrophe was dropped, and so now it's called Folgers. So that's kind of the history of that name. But in terms of the colors, it's very interesting. So our best guess right now is that it traces back to the gold rush era, where many times the miners would wear a red shirt as they would travel into the hills. So it was a very identifiable color. And as I referenced, the original innovation was all about providing packaged roasted ground coffee to gold miners. So it was a familiar color.

SPEAKER_02: 10:24

Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 10:25

And if you look at the San Francisco 49ers, they have red in their logo. And I believe that is for the same reason. It relates back to 49ers, the gold rush, and the colors that the miners would wear. So it all kind of ties together with that red.

SPEAKER_02: 10:41

Well, I wore this red jacket just for you and Folgers today. I

SPEAKER_01: 10:44

really appreciate

SPEAKER_02: 10:45

that, George. Thank you. I seriously did. I love this red jacket, but I'm a believer in the Folgers way of doing things. So we really drink quite a bit of your coffee.

SPEAKER_01: 10:57

We love that. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02: 10:59

Well, you make a great product.

SPEAKER_01: 11:00

Thank

SPEAKER_02: 11:01

you. The hard work pays off, doesn't it? It does. So, of course, there's a slogan that I think most Americans could repeat. The best part of waking up is... That's

SPEAKER_01: 11:12

right.

SPEAKER_02: 11:13

And I imagine that that still resonates. It's been around a long time.

SPEAKER_01: 11:17

It has been.

SPEAKER_02: 11:18

Do you still play that into the marketplace?

SPEAKER_01: 11:22

Not so much. We've pivoted into some newer marketing campaigns, but obviously you can go online and still see the old commercials that have that tagline. On my phone, I actually have the jingle. It's by Rockapella. Once in a while, I want to get energized, I'll play that jingle. And, you know, people still know it and you'll hear them humming it once in a while today.

SPEAKER_02: 11:47

Oh, definitely. I was chatting with my wife this morning and I just started the jingle. She finished it.

SPEAKER_01: 11:54

That's great.

SPEAKER_02: 11:57

So do we have any idea like how the... marketing department came up with i'm really curious about that jingle because storytelling is so vital right to getting a product to the marketplace and getting people to a you know maybe take a chance on something they never tried before right and so uh you know the art of coming up with a very short jingle it is it's almost like i refer to it as Like, can you do a really good billboard design? A lot of billboard designs is terrible. It's so busy. You're going by at 70 miles

SPEAKER_01: 12:34

an hour. You can't see it. I

SPEAKER_02: 12:35

don't know what they're trying to tell me. But the ones that are just a few words and with the right color separation, you can read them. Right. And if they're the right words, the message gets through, doesn't

SPEAKER_01: 12:46

it? That's right. That's exactly right.

SPEAKER_02: 12:48

So is there the science behind that? Can you chat a little bit about that?

SPEAKER_01: 12:53

Well, I mean, you're exactly right. you want to tap into some emotional connection when it comes to branding. That's really important. And at the time, this was owned by P&G, the brand was. And they did a lot of work understanding, again, what are those unmet needs? What is coffee really doing for folks? And it's that, again, it's that morning. So if you look at the old commercials back at that time, you would oftentimes have, because back then we had a vacuum can. You would see somebody putting the can opener in there and you'd hear a wisp. Yeah, a wisp. And then you would usually see a scoop.

SPEAKER_02: 13:31

Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 13:32

And then you would see it dripping into the pot and then you would see it pour. That was a very intentional sequence of events. And when you wake up and you smell that aroma in the morning and you take the sip of that coffee and you feel energy, that is an amazing moment in the day. And so you just pair that up with some words and some really talented musicians that can make a really short piece of music to bring it all together. So the best part of waking up, right? Because sometimes waking up is not the best thing, right? You're sleepy. But the best part of waking up is Folgers in your cup.

SPEAKER_02: 14:08

Yes. You're right. It's the observation of how that emotional experience takes place. You observe it, and then you can put words to it and the music to it. You might just have a nice little jingle there.

SPEAKER_01: 14:24

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02: 14:24

Yeah, great stuff. So now let's move on into the bigger, the world of coffee. Sure. You know, the U.S. coffee market right now, it generates$84 billion in revenue. That's huge. Could you talk a little bit about what sets Folgers apart from the others?

SPEAKER_01: 14:44

Yeah. Well, it really comes down to... you know, products that are designed, they're consistent, like I mentioned a little bit earlier around, you know, year-round, you know exactly what to expect, okay? And that's really important. And the taste profiles that we generate are very thoroughly tested. There's a lot of science engineering that goes into them to make sure that, frankly, the compounds that we're generating in that roast are what consumers want in their flavor and their experience. And we've really got that down to really an exact science now over the years.

SPEAKER_02: 15:20

So, you know, in the last, let's say, 15 or 20 years, a lot of the European coffee houses have made their way into the USA, you know, and of course, they're under different names and whatnot. But, you know, how much attention do you pay? to those evolving trends? I mean, that was a big trend that moved into the US.

SPEAKER_01: 15:42

Sure, sure. Well, we pay a lot of attention to it, frankly, and we need to be aware of those trends and we need to understand, you know, is there anything about our products that we should adjust in order to satisfy perhaps some new consumer needs. And one of the things that we have seen over the years, say the past 20-ish years or so, is a trend towards a little bit darker profiles. And so we have, in some of our products, pushed them a little bit further that direction. And we've even created some products now in the dark space that are doing really well. For example, Folgers Black Silk was exactly that. But we did it in our way. So we did it in a Folger way. So that is a dark, bold product, but it's still very smooth. And that's not something you typically find in dark, dark coffees.

SPEAKER_02: 16:31

Yes. I've been in other parts of the world, and I've had some pretty bitter coffee in my day. You appreciate a smooth cup of coffee when you come back to the USA, I'll tell you. So, in order to get that consistency and smoothness and make it a sustainable system that you could put everywhere, could you talk a little bit about this cupping

SPEAKER_01: 16:58

technique? Oh, sure. You do. Sure, absolutely. So this was another innovation that was brought into the coffee industry, you know, in the San Francisco area, largely driven by Folger. And we believe it may have been tied to the wine industry that had already been established out there where they tasted raw materials, you know, basically the grapes and kind of understood how to use them. So cupping, what that refers to is when you purchase coffee and it comes in, obviously it's raw materials, unroasted. Yes. And There are nuances in taste depending on which origin it was grown in, what the variety of coffee was, and then what the elevation is. And so we bring those coffees in, we roast them very, very lightly, grind them, steep them in water, and then strain them out, and then we taste them. And based on that, a taste assessment, and we have a list of descriptors that are very carefully thought through, we can understand how to then use that product. And that's a pretty standard method in the industry today, to cup your coffee, and again, understand how to use it, but then also, is there something wrong with it? Is it maybe faded, or is there some other issue with it?

SPEAKER_02: 18:08

Yes, so it makes sense. Many of the industries I've come in contact, they have a method Mm-hmm. Very interesting. How does Folgers ensure sustainability in its coffee beans sourcing and supply chain?

SPEAKER_01: 18:30

Yeah, that's a great question. So we have several programs that we do today. We have some programs in country that we go in and we set up projects to help local communities where the coffee is grown. There could be some things like helping them with schools or helping them with infrastructure projects. We also partner with a company called Inveritas, which helps us better understand our supply chain, where the opportunities are. And then we'll fund global projects that go into specifically into those regions and help them out. And then a third angle is a organization we belong to called World Coffee Research. And this is all about developing new varieties of coffee so that in the future, things like disease, drought, you know, things like that, we'll have the right varieties to be able to tackle those challenges.

SPEAKER_02: 19:22

Is that a marketing initiative in the company? I mean, there's a noble cause affiliated with both things that you just covered. Sure. Those are good initiatives. So, you know, how does Folger lead that internally?

SPEAKER_01: 19:36

Yeah. Well, we have, from a consumer-facing standpoint, we have what's called the Folger's Best Part Promise, which really kind of brings all this together and talks about how we're committed to sustainability for the long term. And then we do talk about it internally, and we have groups of people that focus their energy on making these things come to life. It's

SPEAKER_02: 19:57

amazing. The initiatives that big companies like Folger can really, you can really make a difference in the world. Yes, it's Folger's in my cup, but there are other impacts.

SPEAKER_01: 20:10

Yes, significant impacts.

SPEAKER_02: 20:13

Let's talk a little bit about the future. Sure. What's next for Folgers?

SPEAKER_01: 20:19

Well, we're all about understanding consumer needs. We are relentlessly focused on the consumer. And so right now we're looking at what some of those trends that are emerging or maybe are in progress right now. And a good example of that is instant coffee. So Folgers has been in the instant coffee business for several decades. But what we're seeing now is a resurgence in instant. It's very versatile, very easy to use. It's very easy to adjust your strength. If you make a cup and you say, you know, I want a little bit more coffee strength, you know, you can just take your teaspoon and put a little bit more in there. And we also are seeing a lot of usage in different temperature states. So for example, cold. or consumers want to put it directly into milk and have it dissolve. And so we've been looking at that very closely, and we recently launched an iced coffee, Folgers Iced Coffee Instant, and that does exactly what I just mentioned. It can dissolve in hot or cold, and you can also use water or milk. So it's a very versatile product. So we're watching trends like that and seeing where they're going.

SPEAKER_02: 21:27

I have a trend for you in my world of coffee. It's interesting for me. When I first get my cup of coffee, I let it sit. I let it settle for maybe 15, Yeah, not 15 minutes, too cold. Probably about 10 minutes. Okay. And then it's like at the perfect temperature. Okay, yep. But it doesn't stay there very long. Nope. That's right. So we end up, you know, having to, you know, I want to get it out. I want to get it finished before it gets too cool, you know.

SPEAKER_01: 21:55

Yep.

SPEAKER_02: 21:55

So maybe you can do something about that, Jim.

SPEAKER_01: 21:58

Well, I'm going to write it down and take that back. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02: 22:01

Well, thank you for coming in for the show today.

SPEAKER_01: 22:04

It's great to be here.

SPEAKER_02: 22:05

Well, everybody, that's another edition of Tomorrow's World Today. Thanks for tuning in.

SPEAKER_00: 22:11

Thank you for listening to this episode of Tomorrow's World Today podcast. Join us next time as we continue to explore the worlds of inspiration, creation, innovation, and production. Discover more at TomorrowsWorldToday.com, connect with us on social media at TWT Explore, and find us wherever podcasts are available.